I've used 1000 Amps / square inch (in open air) in plating and anodizing shops for many decades, so I think 1/10 of a square inch would be correct for 100 Amps continuous load. Bus bars are also supposed to be clamped together rather than bolted, I believe. A. Hi Mike. Affiliate Link Calculate the 150 x 25 mm busbar current carrying capacity in all the above materials. 0000023458 00000 n
There should be no decline. We do not generally like the copper to come in contact with the plating solution. In same current, copper which apply to DC circuit should be larger than AC 50Hz circuit? Thank you in advance. %PDF-1.5
%
1/4" x 3" bus bar is rated 750 Amps, not 1500 Amps, based on 1000 A/sq.in. 0000008406 00000 n
You have entered an incorrect email address! Chemicals &Consumables I order 38 x 6 mm copper bus-bar / line. You can choose the type of busbar, either aluminium or copper or galvanized bars or iron busbar or silver in the results. Are all components at least 1/4" x 3/4"? DC causes greater heating of the bus. To the degree that they suggest that copper can only carry 70 to 87 percent of what we know for a fact that it has safely and reliably carried in tens of thousands of plating and anodizing installations over 5 or more decades, I think it is they who need to go back to the drawing board :-). Please advise. Yes. Using my current bussing, what are my limits on DC Amperage, and what is the temperature rise above ambient that I should factor in? A. Hi Ajay. =(3.ye!|q& B/PxX Ray. Hope this helps. After calculating voltage drop (V 10.2, please correct me if I'm wrong) the loss in voltage first will result in not getting required voltage at the bus end and heat dissipation will be high (about 20.4 KVA again correct me if I'm wrong) even if I adjusted the source voltage to compensate for the voltage drop the heat is high. 0000004706 00000 n
Best Regards Is cable advisable to use for 700 Amps Oil Cooled rectifier for Nickel plating or it should be Copper bar only. I think the correct answer will be slightly more than 1/10 of a square inch for a peak load for only one second, but I can't say for sure, and feel that the codes probably want you to size things based on maximum-ever loads for safety, not usual loads. I don't see how the voltage drop and cross section calculation you wish to do is any different than Khaled's example which I just worked for you. If there is something you don't understand on this page, we'll be happy to try to explain it in different words until it is completely clear. As R=rho*length/Cross-Sectional Area wouldn't there be a high amount of resistance near the joins due to the area being so small (as the contact is on top resulting in an edge contact, rather than contacting the entire cross-section at the end)? But in my own experience, plating shops rarely use plated ends or buss bar clamps: they just drill holes, and wire brush No-Ox-Id compound onto the joint area before bolting together. (your purchases make finishing.com possible). 0000002007 00000 n
The length of the run is not totally irrelevant, but for typical plating shop runs, like 10.5 m, it's not real important. My question was very simple: So basically I will be making up the busbars myself with a whole lot of 3/8 bolts. here length or long does not affect the current carrying capacity of the busbar. Is this a manually operated installation? free & open in air. Related to the thread, if I intend to use DC cables instead of Copper Bar for connecting rectifiers to the anode and cathode bars, how should I go about deciding what size and kind of cables to buy. 0000017420 00000 n
CDA would encourage the reader to use the more conservative of the two figures, if there is a discrepancy. a 1/2" x 2" buss is listed at 1000 amps. The surface roughening that may occur at the bend is not serious as long as it is only a surface condition. I feel you can proceed with what you have. Parts are hung in the tank using steel fixtures with copper strips to aid the current flow as far as it is possible. note: Please! The minimum bending radius for copper is equal to the thickness of the bar. If you are speaking of an anode rod or cathode bar on top of the tank, yes, it's capacity could be 1500 Amps if it is bussed from both ends (750 A coming in from each end). I never considered that there would be a difference in ampacity for AC vs DC. Sincerely yours, A. Hi cousin Hojat. You can measure the amperage along the length of the cathode bar on each rack/fixture with a tong tester/ammeter to verify the amperage is consistent. 2) How to calculate for DC busbar? I think you may need to retain an experienced electrician, electrical engineer, or plating consultant -- someone who has worked with this stuff and is familiar with the concepts being discussed. Q. A. My opinion, and that's all it is, is that you should have ordered 6 mm x 52 mm (1/4" x 2") bars. 56 0 obj<>stream
As in whether it is better or worse. The internet is largely anonymous & unvetted; some names may be fictitious and some recommendations might be harmful. A. Hi, Naresh. f8\rb;5ezI>KW_~{/b2\Sw91ZO[7_I`69?p_bCxT,(z'A>*p/P~Sq Also do you have an example of how long peak would be measured using your calculations? Q. Good Morning Silver bus bar carries 6000 Amps (1.6*150*25) Current. CapitalEquipment %PDF-1.3
%
If you wish to purchase a copy of the complete Standard, please visit the ATIS Document Center. The spacing between bars is equal to or more than their thickness, and the bars are run in a horizontal plane. The number of sizes shown are not as extensive as those in the tables of AC ampacities, and there may be slight discrepancies between the ampacities shown here and those obtained by calculations derived from AC ampacities. My question are: I am not an electrical person, a mechanical person and it would seem to me to be a fundamental electrical problem, yet I cannot find any information anywhere. Yes, exactly. If you are seeking a product or service related to metal finishing, please check these Directories: Jobshops How would you calculate the length and hole spacing required for a 2000A busbar at 48VDC if using 1/2" x 4" busbar? 1.68 x 10-8 ohm-m x 100 m / (1600 mm2 x 1 m2 / 1,000,000 mm2), so: Sunny. If you are leading each end of your cathode/anode bars from the MAIN busbar, I found that these leads from the MAIN busing should be of the same length. Good day Mihai. However, Storm is suggesting to derate the AC by 30% for DC current meaning those two bars would be 700 and 875 amps. The rectifier terminal often implies what size bus bar the rectifier manufacturer feels is appropriate. Sorry, I don't know the answers for your situation. A. Hello again, Petr. Ted has a good point about the calculations, but this is not written in stone. 0n3p10*@cg,bz%A!A [I
W5X7 Dv8@/}/hB+C 1CpE#'?fbo WJ
endstream
endobj
63 0 obj
240
endobj
26 0 obj
<<
/Type /Page
/Parent 21 0 R
/Resources 27 0 R
/Contents [ 38 0 R 40 0 R 42 0 R 44 0 R 46 0 R 48 0 R 50 0 R 53 0 R ]
/MediaBox [ 0 0 612 792 ]
/CropBox [ 0 0 612 792 ]
/Rotate 0
>>
endobj
27 0 obj
<<
/ProcSet [ /PDF /Text /ImageC ]
/Font << /TT1 33 0 R /TT3 28 0 R /TT5 29 0 R /TT7 35 0 R >>
/XObject << /Im1 51 0 R >>
/ExtGState << /GS1 58 0 R >>
/ColorSpace << /Cs6 34 0 R >>
>>
endobj
28 0 obj
<<
/Type /Font
/Subtype /TrueType
/FirstChar 32
/LastChar 89
/Widths [ 342 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 711 711 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 776 762 724 0 683 650 0 0 546 0 0 637 948 847 850 733 0 782
710 682 812 0 0 0 737 ]
/Encoding /WinAnsiEncoding
/BaseFont /AAMONM+Verdana-BoldItalic
/FontDescriptor 36 0 R
>>
endobj
29 0 obj
<<
/Type /Font
/Subtype /TrueType
/FirstChar 32
/LastChar 176
/Widths [ 352 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 454 454 636 0 364 454 364 454 636 636 636 636 636
636 636 636 636 0 454 0 0 0 0 0 0 684 0 698 771 632 575 0 751 421
0 693 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 616 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 601 623 521 623
596 352 623 633 274 0 592 274 973 633 607 623 623 427 521 394 633
592 818 592 592 525 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 542
]
/Encoding /WinAnsiEncoding
/BaseFont /AAMONO+Verdana
/FontDescriptor 31 0 R
>>
endobj
30 0 obj
<< /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 214 >>
stream
Suggest me the methods of measurement of the resistance and inductance of a copper bus bar. Ceiling Fan Power Consumption Calculation, Power Saving Tips, What is Busbar Current Carrying Capacity Calculation 5 Types of Busbar, AP Electricity Bill Calculator & Rate Per unit Cost 2022, Karnataka Bescom electricity bill calculator & Latest Tariff 2022, DHBVN Electricity Calculator & Per Unit Rate DHBVN, IDMT Tripping Time Calculator, Formula, Calculation, Battery Life Calculator, Formula, Example, Formula, Torque conversion Calculation, Formula, Example, T-Match Impedance Matching Calculation, Formula, Example, Strip line Trace Width Calculation, Formula, Example, Circular Waveguide Calculation, Formula, Example, VSWR Return Loss Calculation, Formula, Example, Trace resistance Calculation, Formula, Example, Tank circuit resonance Calculation, Formula, Example, T-Pad Attenuator Calculation, Formula, Example, Skin Depth Calculator, Calculation With Example, ITI Electrician Whatsapp Group Links Join, 1500+ Active Electrical Engineering WhatsApp Group Links Join, Top 10 Electrical Website for Electrical Engineering Students, Copper bar carries 4500Amps (1.2 x 150 x 25) current, Aluminium Carries 3000 Amps (0.8 x 150 x 25) Current, GI Bus Bar Carries 2250 Amps (0.6*150*25) Current. 4. xb```b``vc`e` |@QYAUVMom;xvPZk'm\2k`` AE+20EXN[AyR~`?e?k1@U '
0000012868 00000 n
Thanks again, Kurt. Now I have a rectifier which the rating the output rating is 12VDC, 4000A.
: I have copper bus bar width = 14 mm, thickness= 6 mm, temperature 100 degrees -- so how to calculate current carrying capacity. 0000005266 00000 n
How to calculate copper bus size for the Continuous DC load of 100A & a peak load of 200A for 1 Sec. I am long familiar with open bus bar systems which have no insulation at all, and which have been used for many decades in plating shops -- but I've also seen movement toward people no longer accepting open bus bar systems as being safe, especially as we get to higher voltages like 24 V. Welding cable sized at 1000 Amps/square inch can be used as an alternative to open bus bar, but doesn't fully address the issue of people working with live 24 v systems. 0000001485 00000 n
Sorry, but we'd just run in circles and never get anywhere if, after 30 postings on a subject, instead of asking for specific clarifications people just say "start over and tell me everything" :-). To me, that's the end of the analysis, the ampacity of the contact is based on the cross sectional area of the bus bar or the header bar, whichever is smaller. Any ideas would be welcome. 3bi50PK k`eiWj. 0000003673 00000 n
%%EOF
A. Hi, Suresh. plating on plastics - New Delhi, India. At 200 amps the joints are heating to 70+ C. Q. Q. 0000001731 00000 n
Khor, for an electroplating bussing installation I would consider the ampacity of a 12 mm x 100 mm busbar (slightly under 1/2" x slightly under 4") to be about 1860 Amps. That is, we have a macro thumb-rule that a square inch of copper can carry 1000 Amps, and we don't apply that macro rule to a micro situation. All information presented is for general reference and does not represent a professional opinion nor the policy of an author's employer. 3) Will the size be different for DC and AC 50 Hz? If these charts indicated higher ampacity than the simple old-fashioned method, I'd want to go along with them. Although it's true that the insulation may make them get somewhat warmer than an open bus bar, I've never personally seen a problem if the old thumbrule of one square inch per 1000 amps of rectifier capacity is used. 0000002933 00000 n
Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. A. Hi Drew. A. Hi TJ. I would like to be able to size the fixtures and other conductors properly so that we avoid the failure problems and improve the efficiency of our plating in general. Sorry that it's hard to be of much more help from such a distance. This would be for a DC combiner with a positive and negative bus to combine lithium battery banks and which would be the common point to power a whole lot of 48V inverters as a large energy storage system/UPS. I think that page should be fine for AC current calculations. Mike. Q. 0000051896 00000 n
coI1
_VdiB ciV2]yl[F-+_M4Eyv%d*`f?{WfnN#!pskam@N~aC
c)Xh J{VRk/b7T^LS))]M I have seen plating shops clear coat or lacquer their bus bar runs (except for the connections of course) and it does seem to hold up well and to look better than streaky green stained copper. Note to readers: The internet is a giant one-room schoolhouse where you can "overhear" stuff and misapply it; I'm talking about copper bus bars carrying DC current in electrowinning operations; I'm not offering a general theory applicable to all electrical contact surfaces :-), Q. Hi 0000001593 00000 n
Hb```f`` P @Qk&00L&,>Ib1O@Ae7N+S.k:Y$l6P0v It is enough dimension for new copper ? 1. 1) What is the actual size of busbar I have to use in this case? HWn}G2in 8abZ?8oUdDN[60}a5u+|q'lm#sW\Oaw2a'Bb=`
{G#huk!iGK):q[hZ!-bWhYs-5
\UkY[Z9~v]/pfo0 A metal tool accidentally shorting out a 15,000 Amp power supply can be a spectacular event! R6td&jPj kT4y. Obviously, this is a suggestion only applicable to submerged plating jigs, and not to be extrapolated that it's okay to figure steel as 10 percent of copper in all applications :-). I've already offered my opinion on cables and the sizing criteria I use twice on this page; maybe someone will offer a second opinion. 0000001060 00000 n
0000002904 00000 n
A. Hi Virendra. A. Hi, Petr. 0000034399 00000 n
They are connected to the plating tanks with solid copper bars. Then again, 100 m is pretty long for a DC bus run. 0000005512 00000 n
Q. That's a lot, and it would apply to each pole if they're both 100 m long. The ampacity rating is based on a 30C rise above a 40C ambient. A. Hi, Hitendra. I would, however, like to make a suggestion. Good luck. !w3ZZ6 0000001854 00000 n
All joints (male/female ) are firm and good contact. Operational, Copper - The World's Most Reusable Resource, Safe Drinking Water Act and Copper Alloys, Toxicological Differences in Lead and Copper, Lead-free Solders for Drinking Water Plumbing Systems, Alliance for Telecommunications Industry Solutions. We electroplate zinc onto ordinary Link chain at 9 VDC @ 3000A. 0000020501 00000 n
Cables are widely used in plating shops. And would it make any difference if use cables instead of copper bars. Would appreciate some help. 0000001800 00000 n
But I have not found a chart stating whether that is AC or DC. This will work, and it should be done immediately before you risk catching the tank liner on fire. www.stormcopper.com/design/Buss-Bar-Ampacities.htm. Here in the USA and in the electroplating industry, the nice round number of 1000 Amps per square inch for open bus bar was universally accepted long before I entered the industry, and that was over 60 years ago :-) 0
30E&J@1"+O'+=J How to calculate the copper busbar size for a given DC current rating ? @ |Kj
;!EGK#&0l"W^Ui0o?wYlnd)Ffvk3mm3;0UE$00b-+fBf[ mKnw'k1Ke/e{SE(Y9k>.VE/xqEaBIM}y7:7"{88Q(Q.PrC(!y$-?^DR xref
9H^Q_P4s25g]DhE=E{H }JSm1G=7B 0000009080 00000 n
0000001608 00000 n
trailer
<<
/Size 64
/Info 22 0 R
/Root 25 0 R
/Prev 176828
/ID[<0106a25d7d8876649a4975b7d4d938f4><263729f7b2ee924bb0cf4b5d40b4daf1>]
>>
startxref
0
%%EOF
25 0 obj
<<
/Type /Catalog
/Pages 21 0 R
/Metadata 23 0 R
/PageLabels 20 0 R
>>
endobj
62 0 obj
<< /S 170 /L 285 /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 63 0 R >>
stream
How to calculate DC bus bar current carrying capacity with respect to temperature. Q. I am looking into the ratings for the Bus bar that is used on my anodizing tanks. <]>>
So, how about if Im using trips 10mm wide, 40mm long and 2mm tick? The resistance of the bus bar is calculated as: R = x l / A endstream
endobj
55 0 obj<>
endobj
57 0 obj<>/XObject<>/ProcSet[/PDF/Text/ImageC]>>>>
endobj
58 0 obj[59 0 R 60 0 R 61 0 R 62 0 R]
endobj
59 0 obj<>
endobj
60 0 obj<>
endobj
61 0 obj<>
endobj
62 0 obj<>
endobj
63 0 obj<>
endobj
64 0 obj<>
endobj
65 0 obj<>
endobj
66 0 obj<>
endobj
67 0 obj<>
endobj
68 0 obj<>stream
Q. 0000001362 00000 n
and as stated above it's in line with 1000 Amp/sq.in. ; J Q. I made 200 amp switch with tin coated copper busbar. Thanks. And if this loss of performance is enough to change or clean the buss bar. 0000003864 00000 n
My existing plating tanks have undersized cathode bars (3"x .75", 4000A rectifier) which cannot be upsized. I'm a new plating learner. 0000011129 00000 n
0000003969 00000 n
Good afternoon. There should be no spot on the switch where the cross sectional area of the copper is less than 1/5 in2 because the current carrying capacity of copper is 1000 A/in2. Sorry, I don't know the codes regarding short circuit protection (if any) in your situation, and my main experience is with low voltage busbar, not 200 V busbar. This gives you measurable but not excessive voltage drops, and warm but not hot bus bars. Distance from rectifier to tank is 10.5 m. The ampacities that follow are from Table 5 of Standard T1.311, and are reproduced here solely for the convenience of the viewer. endstream
endobj
31 0 obj
<<
/Type /FontDescriptor
/Ascent 1005
/CapHeight 734
/Descent -209
/Flags 32
/FontBBox [ -50 -207 1447 1000 ]
/FontName /AAMONO+Verdana
/ItalicAngle 0
/StemV 96
/XHeight 546
/FontFile2 57 0 R
>>
endobj
32 0 obj
<<
/Type /FontDescriptor
/Ascent 891
/CapHeight 656
/Descent -216
/Flags 34
/FontBBox [ -568 -307 2000 1007 ]
/FontName /AAMOPA+TimesNewRoman
/ItalicAngle 0
/StemV 94
/XHeight 0
/FontFile2 61 0 R
>>
endobj
33 0 obj
<<
/Type /Font
/Subtype /Type0
/BaseFont /AAMOMK+Cambria
/Encoding /Identity-H
/DescendantFonts [ 54 0 R ]
/ToUnicode 30 0 R
>>
endobj
34 0 obj
[
/ICCBased 59 0 R
]
endobj
35 0 obj
<<
/Type /Font
/Subtype /TrueType
/FirstChar 32
/LastChar 176
/Widths [ 250 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 333 333 500 0 250 0 250 278 500 500 500 500 500
500 500 500 500 500 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 722 0 667 722 611 556 0 722 333
0 0 611 889 0 0 556 0 667 556 611 0 0 944 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 444
500 444 500 444 333 500 500 278 0 500 278 778 500 500 500 500 333
389 278 500 0 0 500 500 444 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 400 ]
/Encoding /WinAnsiEncoding
/BaseFont /AAMOPA+TimesNewRoman
/FontDescriptor 32 0 R
>>
endobj
36 0 obj
<<
/Type /FontDescriptor
/Ascent 1005
/CapHeight 734
/Descent -209
/Flags 96
/FontBBox [ -166 -208 1705 1000 ]
/FontName /AAMONM+Verdana-BoldItalic
/ItalicAngle -15
/StemV 184.396
/FontFile2 60 0 R
>>
endobj
37 0 obj
3600
endobj
38 0 obj
<< /Filter /FlateDecode /Length 37 0 R >>
stream
Please get tables from suppliers like stormcopper or consult the National Electrical Code. I have a rectifier it gives output 24 volts DC and 15000 amps at source to load in distance 6 m, 5 m, 2 m, 1 m. At what size of busbar(or) cables are taken my application and what type of insulation I prefer to the bus bus at safe conditions. 0000023480 00000 n
There response was: How can I determine the resistance of the fixture when I have no idea about its temperature? Good question. DC currents have no inductance; inductance is the voltage induced rather by a non-steady-state current. A. Regards. Don't forget to check the ampacity of the anode rod when you fix the cathode rod. I believe de-rate AC values around 30%. .Xk6s(s$~h$H% The allowable current carrying capacity of enclosed bus bar in bus ducts is a little bit lower because of lack of cooling; since bus duct is a standardized product, you'll see the numbers in product literature and electrical codes. 0000083756 00000 n
I have a question for you: what's the whole voltage drop, cross section and short circuit current computing procedure of a DC busbar? when submerged, even if the particular steel were a little lower in conductivity. 0000001572 00000 n
Maximum current 400 A on 8 ~ 10 V DC. Are there ways to make the corrosion more manageable. Which methods I can apply to do the same. I think that's the case with the triangular bus bars, which are intended to deliver a knife-edge (and therefore better) contact surface. Then it will want to bank back and be a massive resistance as its going back into a very small area? Are you sure the copper is all hard drawn electrolytically pure? Drew, "No-Ox-Id" Compound 0000034377 00000 n
Will connecting both ends of the cathode bar decrease the resistance through the cathode bar to the 40 plating racks evenly spaced on the bar? I have a follow up please, what about fixtures for hanging the parts in the tank? Some electrical people I talk to say DC current is like water, so that you can use the entire cross-section of the triangle as it is like spilling into a tank, but what about the other end? Is there a significant difference between AC ampacity and DC ampacity? I know that the surface corrosion will have a very small impact but that the connections could be significant. L = E / (dI/dt). I understand resistivity of metals increases with temperature and that I can decrease resistance by increasing the cross section of the conductor, but how do I know at what temperature (resistivity) will the conductor arrive if I send a given current through it? Apex Tool Group - York, Pennsylvania USA, (your purchases make finishing.com possible). 24 0 obj
<<
/Linearized 1
/O 26
/H [ 1240 353 ]
/L 177436
/E 115625
/N 4
/T 176838
>>
endobj
xref
24 40
0000000016 00000 n
0000011343 00000 n
I don't have any knowledge of busbar size calculation; please send me choice of a correct busbar sizes for required current rating. So you would need 645 * 400/1000 = 258 square millimeters, and you've only got 228. A. Hi Joe. 0000004455 00000 n
Lifetime Picnic Table,
Tommy Bahama Two Palms Dress,
Fenway Park Concert Seating Chart Paul Mccartney,
Summer School Programs 2022,
Craft Projects With Contact Paper,
Long White Lace Kimono,
Plantronics Convertible Wireless Headset,